Opa1612 vs ne5532 sound quality. It measures better to, with LM4562, but the difference is much smaller than the sound differences. I bought 100 NE5532's for the same money, and the MUSES02 is basically about the same as an NE5532 without the high current handling I think. Download. Click to expand I have my A04 equipped with a pair of Oracle 02 op amps which apparently have been torn down by an Ali express customer and found to be an modded opa1612. 2. The LME49720 is better than the NE5532 in many respects such as the noise figure and distortion. The NE5532 also has 8 legs but is less than half the size. My understand if noise isn’t a problem the opa1656 is great alternative to the opa1612. These were wired to use USB input to the Swing from my laptop, the DAC (fixed voltage) RCA outputs of the Swing to the RCA inputs on the Fun, and the Hifiman He560, Sennheiser 800, and Campfire Cascade (with Cloth pads) used for all listening sessions. Find parameters, ordering and quality information Apr 21, 2019 · Sound: For purposes of these tests, I started out with a Burson Swing and Fun DAC and amplifier. 00008% • Low noise: 8 nV/√Hz Jan 23, 2009 · Op-amp Replacement for 4580 (JRC) Jul 11, 2022 · I would not equal best sound with lowest THD. Oct 10, 2020 · In the case of Aiyima a04 ( I have two of them ) it is very clear that the sound quality gets better with LM 4562 instead of NE5532. The OPA1611 and OPA1612 offer rail-to-rail output swing to within 600 mV with a 2-kΩ load, which increases headroom and maximizes dynamic range. OPA1612 is decent the only reason I'd use anything May 6, 2022 · Opamp better than OPA2604 with big soundstage, and Feb 10, 2024 · Fosi Audio ZA3 Amplifier Review Dec 9, 2019 · Home: RME ADI-2 Pro FS R BE—Neumann KH80 DSP, Arendal Sound 1723 1S Work from Home: JDS Labs Atom—Etymotic ER4SR, AKG K371, Sennheiser HD820 Measurement: Earthworks M30 (Reed R8090)—Earthworks ZDT 1021 — RME ADI-2 Pro FS R BE — REW May 19, 2017 · Something better than the LM4562? The OPA1611 (single) and OPA1612 (dual) bipolar-input operational amplifiers achieve very low 1. . I have tried ne5532, opa2604, lm4562 and opa1612 and I prefered LM 4562 in both Aiyima a07 and the tpa3251-based Aiyima a04. 1nV/√Hz at 1kHz bipolar-input operational amplifiers achieve very low Jul 4, 2009 · Here’s a great article comparing opa2156 CMO vs opa1612. As a rough guide if the values in your circuit are a few K, likely given its a filter, you should be OK, if they are few hundred k then there may be problems. TI’s OPA1612 is a SoundPlus™ Audio Operational Amplifier with 1. May 22, 2015 · G'day all, listening to my P06 in here with NE5532's installed of late, it seems to me that if the NE5532 has a 'sound' about it, it is neutral, completely uncoloured and clean. The LM4562 will improve the performance measurably as it has much lower THD than the NE5532. Feb 11, 2021 · Even AD797 or OP627 cant hold a candle vs OPA1612 in terms of SQ - the difference is HUGE! My preamp sounds best with OPA1612 for gain and OPA2192 as buffer. i expected them to put some Oct 8, 2001 · It (in its present-day format of the NE5534) has remained at the top of audio quality ever since. I've had an OPA1612 lose its mind in a filter circuit where an LME49720 worked just fine. The OPA2604 and AD823 are both good too, how good are you at soldering SMDs? May 21, 2023 · The 5532’s sound congested, with a dry “mechanical” sound in which music doesn’t flow quite as well, and doesn’t sound as alive as it will with better op-amps. net's impressive 320kbps audio quality. Jul 11, 2022 · I would not equal best sound with lowest THD. 00005% at 1 kHz Nov 9, 2012 · Has anyone ever had experience with MUSE opamps? Mar 8, 2013 · Can I replace NE5532 opamp by two AD825 on a kind of browndog dual DIP8 pcb adaptor? And can I replace NE5534 opamp by one AD825 on a DIP8 adaptor? I hope to enhance sound quality, of course. Opa1642 sounds a bit smoother and silky at top end but a little bit fat in the mids. If the NE5532 improved its HF performance it would sound the best of all these by a reasonable margin . High-Quality Audio at 320kbps: Enjoy your music at its best with YouConvert. 5Vdc. amp. Replacements: For the 5532 the opa2211A or opa1612 as well as LT1358. I've actually used CMOS LDOs designed for audio and they improve the noise levels immensely! There is a paper out there that I read online comparing the Opa1656 to Opa1612. but the difference between opa2604 and LME49720 is much smaller than the difference between these two compared to the original ne5532. alongside with some aliexpress el`cheapos for like 2 buck a piece instead of 7. Before any modifications I use shematics to see what i need to choose between these four Op-Amps. However some manufactures (eg, NAD 3150) went for +/-18. NE5532 are in the analog output stageof the AA cdplayer Paganini 24/192, NE5534 are in the power stage of the AA integrated Puccini SE. However, for very low-noise microphone applications, a dedicated mic preamp IC or a lower-noise op-amp like the OPA1612 or LT1115 may be a better choice. With proper decoupling the 5532 can sound pretty good. Dec 10, 2015 · A fair question! And although I was the product definer and systems lead for this part, I don't get 100% control over the marketing folks But, I can honestly say that when we started working on this part about a year ago, I was very adamant that I didn't want to create a part with excellent specs but terrible sound quality in the real world. 2068 voltage noise IS lower than the 5532, but I cannot find a spec on Jul 26, 2020 · If we like it or not the NE5532 is outclassed by a far margin. Both (I believe have Fet-inputs) There’s also 2189 CMOS audio op amp has impressive specs of an impressive was designed for MUX friendly DACs and multichannel dacs! The OPA1611 (single) and OPA1612 (dual) bipolar-1• Superior Sound Quality input operational amplifiers achieve very low • Ultralow Noise: 1. This is a straight-to-the-point review, so don’t expect a long, detailed review on the sound quality. 5). The TLO72 has a very limited ability to drive a load, it's prone to latch up if the inputs are overloaded, and has many other "features" that make it undesirable for audio in my opinion. The most important thing to look for when choosing an op amp for audio is making sure it is stable at the gains you intend to use it for e. 1-nV/√Hz noise density with an ultralow distortion of • Ultralow Distortion: 0. e Aug 24, 2012 · i tryed lme49722 opa2134 and opa1612 ,--. NE5532 has a higher slew rate (9v/uSec vs, 6). Mike Dec 15, 2015 · Texas Instruments Introduces Highest-Performance Next- Aug 13, 2014 · Touting sound quality in the datasheet makes it sound 300% better. who builds large PA speaker systems. Jun 10, 2010 · From my experience these older OP/ OPA op amps all sound vaious degrees of "not-that-great" (cloudy, lacking details, taking away punch/immediateness). So, it is a different design and chip. designed to drive high-performance audio analog-to-digital converters (ADCs) or as a predriver for class-D amplifiers. 5 nV/sqrt(Hz) of input noise VS 5 nV/sqrt(Hz) of NE5532 (NE5534 is quieter but I need a dual chip). The TL072 is around a half inch rectangle with 8 legs going into a socket. I upgraded the volume pot and built an external large transformer power supply (in lieu of a "tap" from the original power amp;s transformer). The OPA1632 has an excellent gain bandwidth of 180 MHz, and a very fast slew rate Oct 8, 2001 · TI/Burr Brown's OPA2604 is a good alternative as well. Mar 5, 2018 · However, swapping opamps seems to be more dependent on the surrounding circuitry, their quality and PCB layout, than the opamp itself. I got a TI NE5532 off ebay. OPA2134 is basic hi quality Op-Amp and all rounder Op-Amp with great sound. 1 nV/√Hz at 1 kHz 1. May 22, 2015 · I recently reconnected a DIY kit preamp (Series 5000) I made in the 80's. r/audiophile is a subreddit for the pursuit of quality audio reproduction of all forms, budgets, and sizes of speakers. Jul 26, 2020 · But if the NE5532 is GREAT than the newer TI OpAmps like OPA1612, OPA2228, OPA1692, OPA2209 etc are: OUTSTANDING, MARVELOUS, EXTRAORDINARY, UNMATCHED, OUT OF THIS WOLRD, EXTREME Über OpAmps! Last edited: 2020-08-22 3:52 pm Apr 10, 2019 · I have interested in low ESR Electrolytic Capacitors to power the Opa1612. The OPA1612 offers rail-to-rail output swing to within 600 mV with a 2 kΩ load, which increases headroom and maximizes dynamic range. My statements were verified: - OPA1611/1612 are optimized for better distortion than the OPA211 (already pretty good). It really does still sound very nice in my system and the MC phono stage is excellent, quite surprising after having used various hi end preamps over the years, It uses NE5532's or May 9, 2023 · Hello together, i want to put one of the mentioned OP Amps in my amp. Aug 28, 2023 · LM4562 vs NE5532: What are Differences and How to Nov 26, 2017 · thanks for your tips! i have tested the opa2604 and the LME49720 compared to the ne5532. OPA1656 sounded worst, Muses 8920 sounded best. Nov 8, 2023 · New Aiyima A07 MAX Amplifier - Small Footprint, Good Sound Feb 17, 2023 · Some will point out the OPA1612 (which is even better) or the OPA1656. Feb 11, 2021 · According to the TI datasheets OPA1612 has less noise than OPA1656. Personally I find running op-amps in class AB a bad idea since this inevitably creates crossover distortion and it is entirely up to GNFB to reduce this ugly kind of distortion, and GNFB becomes less effective in the higher frequency range. IMHO the outcome was mostly decided by how the opamps responded to the RF coming out of the dac chip. Jul 30, 2021 · If I could also request test of: OPA1642 ~ 2 Euro OPA1656 ~ 2. Jul 5, 2006 · Hi All, Please advise what would be the best bet for a modern replacement of the NJM353 in my 12-15 years old vintage 4X60W Class A Zero Feedback car amplifier? Tried dual OPA627AU on adaptor but the sound is of reduced volume, of loss details and PCB is warmer than before and the noob in me did not realized the input current of 7mA X 2 or 14mA for the each of 4 dual adaptor as compared to NE5532 data sheet, product information and support OPA1612 ™ High-Performance, Bipolar-Input AUDIO OPERATIONAL AMPLIFIERS Check for Samples: OPA1611 OPA1612 1FEATURES DESCRIPTION 23• SUPERIOR SOUND QUALITY The OPA1611 (single) and OPA1612 (dual) • ULTRALOW NOISE: 1. It's quite funny how the diy audio crowd rave about the opamps marketed towards audio and shy away from the ones that aren't. Dec 13, 2007 · PSRR- power supply rejection ratio. Jun 19, 2021 · My multibit DAC built here and here sound wonderful. I hesitate to recommend those without simulating the circuit. Mar 30, 2012 · I have a Crate VC508 guitar amplifier that many recommend modding by replacing the TL072CP opamp chip. I know there are better op amps, but they are not available here, so these are my only 2 options: LM833 or NE5532 Based on data sheet info LM833 has 4. Apr 6, 2020 · The NE5532 supports a max supply voltage of +/-22Vdc and a nominal supply of +/-15Vdc. These three Op-Amps sounds great. The TL072 isn't great IMO. Like in this post, the DAC is dual PCM56P then using internal IV converter to the LPF section. Its high slew rate and wide bandwidth make it a go-to choice for audio processing, ensuring that the magic of May 30, 2015 · Maybe, the 5532 has a low input impedance and swapping it for a circuit that uses high value resistors can cause problems. Description: SoundPlus High-Performance, Bipolar-Input Audio Operational Amplifiers. Apr 12, 2024 · 5. Dec 5, 2023 · NE5532. The Features of OPA2134 • Superior Sound Quality • Ultra-Low Distortion: 0. The OPA1611 (single) and OPA1612 (dual) bipolar-input operational amplifiers achieve very low 1. NE5532 was VERY good in LF and midrange performance. Basically they don't really tick the low-noise box convincingly - the voltage noise is OK but not low enough to compete for microphone or MC phono duty, the current noise is poor for higher impedance circuits. Bass is also fairly one-note and lacks a bit of impact, and each instrument sounds less distinct in the 5532’s congested stage than they do with better op-amps. "night and day" differences between good circuits are usually exaggerations of very small differences, or wishful thinking. Link to comment Oct 8, 2001 · NE5532/34 is the best op amp for audio. This is based on my experience with the V5i-D. What do you think? Thanks in advance. 5 Euro OP275 ~ 3 Euro OPA1612 ~ 6 Euro According to specs I would think the OPA1642 would be one of the best compromises cost vs performance wise. 000. Our primary goal is insightful discussion of home audio equipment, sources, music, and concepts. Can I use the NE5532 for microphone preamplification? Yes, the NE5532 can be used as a microphone preamp, especially when configured as a balanced input preamp with sufficient gain. 6 mA but I know I’m in the Op amp thread so I don’t want to take the thread off topic. Transients are stronger, both rimshots of snare drum and big-band trumpets. common mode voltage that I've measured on any op amp. The OPA1611 and OPA1612 OPA1612 Dual OPA DIP8 (Unit) Mar 9, 2023 · SMSL SU-10 vs M500 MKIII vs DO300 21 vs 9 vs 11 dual op-amps OPA1612 (accoring to the spec from smsl-audio) What is the Op-amps doing in that? M500 SINAD is higher than DO300 with less op-amps. Aug 8, 2023 · Welcome to Z Tech Mentor! In this video, we delve into the comparison between NE5532 and 4558D Operational Amplifier ICs, focusing on their sound quality and Jun 18, 2019 · Hello everyone, I have the DAC Emotiva XDA-1 preamp with the DAC Analog Devices AD1955 and Burr Brown OPA-2134 op-amps, I want to update to the Burson Audio Play with the DAC: ESS Technology SABRE32 / ESS9018 and NE5532 X 3, NE554 X 2 op-amps, would it be a good update to the Burson Audio? thank you very much to all. Jun 23, 2007 · Currently it is working with NE5532. The V5i is a hybrid of sorts which includes both IC and discrete components, but is much smaller and should fit in virtually any build. tnt-audio. Same opamp could sound more open and with a darker background when tested in equipment #1, but may sound with a much closer scene and with a bit of hiss-noise when installed in equipment #2. Voice reproduction was BEST in the NE5532 ! Unfortunately it was a bit low in the HF. com The OPA1611 (single) and OPA1612 (dual) bipolar-1• Superior Sound Quality input operational amplifiers achieve very low • Ultralow Noise: 1. OPA1612 is fuller sounding - especially lower midrange but also more dynamic. THD is just one of the metrics that are used to judge quality. Nov 9, 2010 · LM4562 / LME49720 / LME49860 - Do they sound different Feb 11, 2018 · Two cases were evalutated – in a Breeze Audio AK4495 based DAC, driving a ATHA5000 amp (listening via Beyer T1’s), and then driving a Grado RA1 clone (basically a CMOY circuit) to hear the amp character more closely through a set of Senn HD800. I don't care about listening tests or something else, just want to use the technical better one in my amp. Nov 21, 2019 · There's are reasons people use NE5532's and JFET opamps, and low current-noise is a notable one. Meaning the audio circuit designed for them. The LME49860 is another option. Mar 22, 2022 · OPA1612 (soic on dil adapter board), bi-polar from input to output, again a very good opamp, which to me "sounds more balanced" top to bottom than the LME, it is just as dynamic, but just a little less obvious in the bass leading edge because the mid-range seems a little more fleshed out rich and full bodied, highs are just as good as the LME. • audio·phile: a person with love for, affinity towards or obsession with high-quality playback of sound and music. The LPF section in every DAC is very critical. Mar 17, 2019 · Hi everyone - wanted to take the opportunity on this thread to introduce myself, I am the engineer that is assuming John's old role as Audio systems engineer in the precision op. Dec 17, 2018 · Have a significantly better sound by upgrading the stock NE5532 op amps to something more ‘high end’ and modern like the OPA627-AP? How these op amps actually compares (sound wise) in your opinion? May 23, 2018 · The first time I did test with opa1642 opa2156 (precision opamp version of opa1656) opa1612. 1nV/√Hz Noise, Low THD and Precision. It's supposed to be a stright up replacement but it's about a third of the size. Use a simple resistor, or a J-fet with the IDSS trimmed to 3mA~5mA. Oct 15, 2014 · Texas Instruments' OPA1612 (dual) bipolar-input operational amplifier achieves very low 1. if the gain is going to be x1 then you would need a unity gain stable op amp. 3. The OPA1632 delivers excellent audio quality, very low noise, large output voltage swing, and high current drive. Features of OPA2134 vs NE5532 . And what about low voltage applications? Mar 19, 2014 · The NE5532 is far superior to the TLO72 in just about every way for audio use, only real exception being the 5532s' relatively large input current spec. Transients were still good but the HF levels seemed to be a bit rounded off. I repeated my measurements by creating a better calibration file and also using the manual fundamental feature in REW. Jul 4, 2009 · If I'm in the mood for that so called "burr-brown" slower lazier sound I prefer the OPA2228 but as with my comments about the AD8066 below you can't just drop that into any old circuit and get good results - the OPA2227 is a more drop in replacement but doesn't sound quite the same as the 2228. Feb 11, 2021 · I do hope the sound quality improves much more than the FFTs. When we developed the OPA1656, this was also a major design target for us, and the designer and myself spent quite awhile in the lab with previous CMOS audio op amps (specifically OPA1652 and OPA1688) hunting for sources of input capacitance variation. I also have been an audio enthusiast for quite a while, having tinkered or created several guitar effects/amps. BTW, last year I crippled my €4. The OPA1611 and OPA1612 Supreme Sound Opamp V5i The OPA1611 (single) and OPA1612 (dual) bipolar-1• Superior Sound Quality input operational amplifiers achieve very low • Ultralow Noise: 1. the best sounding is OPA1612 ,not for driving headphones -low output current drive ,3ma current consumption ---then opa2134 the best all around as preamplifier it can be used at high gain 6-10 times,very good sounding and Musical,good for biassing in class A. Jan 10, 2016 · I talked yesterday to my buddy Greg B. 1 nV/√ Hz at 1 kHz; Ultralow Distortion: 0. I can easily compair them , one with NE5532 and the other with LM 4562. Mar 17, 2019 · We tried OPA1612, OPA1656, NE5532, and Muses 8920 opamps in Rohm BD34301EKV Evaluation Board (which came with 5532's installed). Part #: OPA1612. LME49720 sound is boringand too light. 8 bucks for a genuine part. g. The OPA1611 and OPA1612 OPA1612-Q1 SoundPlus High-Performance, Bipolar-Input We would like to show you a description here but the site won’t allow us. 000 (DIY!) tube preamp with tube Mar 14, 2010 · NE5532 is a very good amplifier especially for the price ($0. And this preamp sounds MUCH better than Audio Research, Burmester and Accuphase preamps costing above €10. Mar 7, 2019 · Sometime I use OPA1612, OPA1642 and OPA1622. But that does not say anything about the SQ. The OPA1611 and OPA1612 Jan 5, 2020 · After some delay due to work load, some time wasted with talking and arguing to some holes in the wall in the Digital forums, and a false start with the PCB (used the wrong footprint for the OPA1612 DFN) here's the board with the composite I/V stage, OPA1612 + BUF634A and OPA1611 output. Manufacturer Dec 6, 2018 · The NE5532 is all you'll ever need? I don't know about that. my opinion. This ensures that every beat and note is preserved, providing a listening experience that rivals the original video. It has the most stable input capacitance vs. the ne5532 looks a bit harder, narrower and more direct, the other two a bit more relaxed and The OPA1611 (single) and OPA1612 (dual) bipolar-1• Superior Sound Quality input operational amplifiers achieve very low • Ultralow Noise: 1. group at Texas Instruments. It's not very good in applications which require a high input impedance, where a J-FET input op-amp is pretty much essential, although I suppose one could add a discrete J-FET input stage to the NE5532, for those applications. 1 nV/√Hz noise density with an ultra-low distortion of 0. Which of the two mentioned OP Amps (OPA1612 or OPA1656) is the better one, in a scientific point of view. Feb 11, 2021 · As Mark pointed out OPA1612 is a terrific sounding opamp and if you have problems with its bold mighty extreme low bass performance or with the extreme high resolution and unfiltered highs you can use other new opamps with a more gentle sound like OPA2209, OPA2189 etc. Both fet based opamps sounds a little bit more solid in the bass (not quantity but the imaging and the texture). Alone the electrical performance (measurements) is in another league in comparison to newer OPAs and ADs. Thanks in Jul 4, 2009 · I would imagine CMOS opamp hit their spec sheets performance in CMOS audio application. A caution; when replacing parts on older high powered amplifiers is that any change of transistor types may upset the stability of the amplifier. Even an older OPA2604 (better than a NE5532) sounds distorted vs OPA2209 (i. Page: 31 Pages. Mar 5, 2007 · 3. オペアンプの違いによる音質比較表 Apr 11, 2024 · Both op-amps deliver exceptional audio quality, with the selection between the two depending on the specific requirements of the audio circuit and the desired balance between performance and cost. (NOTE: We once owned a recording studio together back in the late 1970's through the early 1980's. --lme49722 lme4562 lm4562 opamp is very good sound ,higher ratings than opa2134 -but not as Jun 5, 2023 · After working with some OPA1612 on my recent Topping PA5 D01 Module replacement project (at ASR), a friend sent me a few OPA1612 opamps he ordered when they were in stock since i couldnt get them anywhere. Nov 2, 2010 · Try a pull-down load to the negative supply rail to force the NE5532 into class A, just a few mA will really make it sound better. ) He talked to me about OPA1611's versus OPA134's as well as the OPA1612's versus OPA2134's. - high levels of DC precision are generally not required by audio customers (audio equipment makers). You really don't want a tl072 dealing with 20mA into such low impedances. Step into the world of audio alchemy, and the NE5532 is your potion master. Jun 7, 2016 · Burson Audio Supreme Sound Opamp V5i - Reviews Aug 3, 2013 · "Search, "Op amps in small signal audio design - Part-3" to see an analysis of the actual audio performance differences of the various op amps. Oct 8, 2001 · The ne5532 is a great op amp. More details can be found here: Howto - Distortion Measurements with REW The new results of the CS4392 with stock NE5532 output filter is attached as image 1. edit: looking closer at the pics, the I/V resistors are 390R (about half the datasheet values, which makes sense as they // the outputs). It's also a smaller form factor than the originals, which is crucial for installing in tight circuits / spaces. OPA1612 sounds better than any transistor preamp I've ever heard and better then my own 6N6P 2 case -no barrels hold- 36kg monster preamp with a 100% double blind test win rate. It is the best $1 opamp you can get! Sure, there are opamps that perform better spec-wise---the LM4562/LME49720 is the best PDIP-8 available, only surpassed in the bipolar world by the SOIC-only OPA1612. Aug 22, 2009 · I talked to a TI/B-B applications engineer today. Sound is more "color", and "massive". 1-nV/√ Hz noise density with an ultralow distortion of 0. I did not get paid for saying something good or bad. It appears that the May 15, 2022 · Now i tested opa1612 with lme49720 and 1612 is better in my opinion. One good example is XU09 portable headphone amplifier. Jun 7, 2016 · Sound Quality Disclaimer: 1. Conclusion Superior Sound Quality; True JFET Input Operational Amplifier With Low Input Bias Current; Low Noise: 5. Everything that I wrote here are “IMHO” and as is. You need the circuit schematic really to figure out the noise impedance of the various stages, and any existing decoupling. - Page 2 OP Amp Rolling: the Philips CD753 (aka Marantz CD5000) with MUSES8820 vs OPA1692 vs LME49723 and Others - an article by Paul Hunting on TNT-Audio, Internet HiFi magazine, www. This made it a pretty minimalistic set-up to get a close view of the opamp differences. Well, the lower distortion of the newer opamps are a fact and I can hear that VERY clearly. It has a strong output stage as well as JFET inputs. bipolar in the NE5532) there may some perceivable performance differences. the differences aren't huge, but big enough to make a change worthwhile. Mar 17, 2019 · The OPA1641 would be slightly better. The National LME amps should be better than the 5534 in about every regard but IMO, it should be tough, if not impossible, to tell the difference between properly designed circuits using either one. My main attraction to them is a higher ripple current in the AC to “ power” the board onward as the opa1612 only requires low quiescent current of 3. Previously I did some changes especially in all technical aspect and evaluate the sound quality improvement from that changes. File Size: 1MbKbytes. Because of (at least) the input stage differences (JFET vs. For the case of Nov 25, 2015 · LM4562 vs OPA2134 vs [ ? ] Feb 28, 2021 · The best sounding op amps for audio work. 000015% at 1 kHz. Jul 4, 2021 · This doesn't look like a high quality pcb and it would be easy to lift traces. So LM833 is quieter. bgu cgoeg zewr ynsgt deqfw jginy btorbg fldpje qke bgctct